PARKJET MOTOR BENCH TESTING

Discussion in 'Electronics' started by e3_Scott, Jul 6, 2013.

  1. Combatevolved

    Combatevolved Ace Pilot

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    Awesome. I hope it stands up to the hype and passes our performance scrutiny. Emax has an enviable reputation in the rc quad racing motor arena. (It would be interesting to try this on a 5s 5x3 prop for fin )
     
  2. Flybyknight22

    Flybyknight22 Top Gun

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    Now that,.. is some tight, tight, super tight info right there my brother!
     
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  3. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    Continuing some testing with quad racing motors, this time on 4S :)

    I picked up a couple of Tattu R-Line 1550 4S 75C quad racing batteries, you can read about my initial impressions and some bench testing I did already here http://scottsparkjetblog.blogspot.ca/2018/05/tattu-r-line-1550-4s-75c-batteries.html

    My post flight thoughts after flying a few more flights on 4S after the video shot below http://scottsparkjetblog.blogspot.ca/2018/05/field-test-of-emax-rs2306-2750-kv-motor.html

    Here are the thrust numbers for the EMAX 2306 2750 kv motor, 6x3 EMP prop, HobbyWing Platinum PRO 40A ESC (custom settings of 26.25 degrees timing and 8 KHz PWM frequency) and the Tattu 4S battery. You can read more of the test details on the motor test spreadsheet here as well as find all the links for the components listed. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KLR_wdkJ1OdGcf5f9jxxxU8qqmz_kXjMQH8NOLjW3NQ/edit?usp=sharing

    50% throttle - 21.8A/346.5W producing 940 gr/33.2 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 54.8A/860.2W producing 1630 gr/57.5 oz of thrust.

    Here is the flight video.


    After some discussions with rcplanepirate, I will also be testing some 5" props of various pitch and design when they arrive in a few weeks.

    Hobby King

    HobbyKing 5040 GRP/nylon prop https://hobbyking.com/en_us/glass-fib...

    Dalprops "Indestructible" Bull Nose 5045 V2 https://hobbyking.com/en_us/dalprop-5...

    Diatone Bull Nose Plastic Propellers 5 x 4.5 https://hobbyking.com/en_us/diatone-b...

    Banggood

    DALPROP 5045 Bullnose PC Propeller https://www.banggood.com/2-Pairs-DALP...

    Gemfan 5045 5 Inch Propeller Bullnose https://www.banggood.com/4PCS-Bullnos...

    KINGKONG/LDARC 5040 Propellers https://www.banggood.com/10-Pairs-KIN...

    After what I saw at the field, I think having a shorter prop with some more pitch will really help out, but only testing on the bench and at the field will prove that theory :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  4. Your chuckle has changed on the fly-by's ;) , speed can be addicting, welcome to the wildside. :D Cruises really nice Scott.
     
  5. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Thanks. I have built and flown a few fast park jets in my time, not my first rodeo. Perhaps my chuckle has changed, maybe fly your fastest plane a few feet in front of your face at full throttle a few times during a flight, I would be interested to hear what sounds come out of your mouth.:)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  6. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    As part of my journey testing quad racing motors in park jets for almost a year now, I have also been experimenting with a couple of ESCs that are new to me that you may have heard me mention in this thread and through many of my videos. I have had some pretty good success with both of them. I still use my old reliable Turnigy Plush 40A ESC on occasion, but I am still using the older (and then much cheaper at about $17) V3.1, I note that Hobby King now sells the V4.2. Both these ESCs below once I found some custom settings have allowed my motors to perform on average about 5-7% better than my old Plush ESCs were.

    The HobbyWing Platinum PRO 40A ESC https://www.banggood.com/HobbyWing-...l-p-70384.html?rmmds=myorder&cur_warehouse=CN is of course pretty expensive at $40.16 USD (fortunately I got mine when Banggood had them on sale for about $30 (which is still pretty expensive for an ESC I suppose :)), but it performs beyond any other 40A ESC I have ever used, really showing it's abilities with my recent foray into 4S use. It has a 60A burst rating and seems to dissipate the heat exceptionally well, has a wide range of settings with with to experiment and I have been quite pleased with it.

    The Turnigy AE-45A ESC has also been a nice discovery as it is reasonably priced (when it is in stock) https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-ae-45a-brushless-esc.html and again has a wide range timing settings to fine tune the best performance from a motor/prop combo. I think it might be just a bit overrated in it's amp ratings, but I have pushed it right to the limit on many occasions and despite being warm when I land, it has yet to fail me.

    I shot these two "mid term" review videos awhile ago and will update them again after flying these ESCs through the heat of the summer.




    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  7. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I had my modified F22 V5 out for some fun today:)


    Today I was also field testing the GepRC GR2306 2750 kv motor with the 6x4 APC gas prop as I had not done that and necessity forced me to put the slightly shorter prop in the F22 as I explain after landing in the video.

    I was very pleased with the power delivery of this motor with this prop, it continues to be the most powerful quad racing motor I have tested both on the bench and in the air, at least on 3S. I was a bit worried the motor might run a bit warm as with the combo in the video above, it was pulling 45A, but it was actually just slightly warm as was the ESC. You can read the full test numbers as well as find the links for all the components discussed on the motor test spreadsheet here https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KLR_wdkJ1OdGcf5f9jxxxU8qqmz_kXjMQH8NOLjW3NQ/edit?usp=sharing

    With the 6x4 APC gas prop, Turnigy AE-45A ESC with custom settings of 22.5 degrees and 24 KHz PWM frequency on 3S, here are the test numbers

    50% throttle - 19.9A/238W producing 685 gr/24.2 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 45A/506.3W producing 1115 gr/39.2 oz of thrust.

    Thus far I have been very impressed with this motor and can't wait to test it on 4S, I might give it a try with the 6x3 EMP prop on the bench until the 5" props I have ordered show up and see how we make out :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  8. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    Just realized this thread is coming up on being five years old :) Through that time, many folks other than me have contributed a lot to this thread, great to see and I certainly appreciate everyone's interest and participation :)

    Motivated by all the field and bench testing I have been doing almost constantly through the last year since I started experimenting with quad racing motors in park jets, I shot this video discussing my thoughts and experiences comparing and validating results achieved on the bench and how those might carry over to the field.


    A few of the highlights of all this experience (or is it misspent youth...please Santa, bring me a life for Christmas this year;)).

    It is not always the prop that provides the best thrust numbers on the bench that provides the best experience/performance at the field. Some motor/prop combos perform better under dynamic field conditions, some about what is to be expected and some worse than what the bench numbers might indicate, there is really no alternative to just getting out there and seeing how it performs in the best test lab, the flying field:).

    Experimenting with props with your power system in your particular flying environment can sometimes unlock a "hidden treasure" to give you the flight experience you seek from your plane. As long as you are not overloading your motor/ESC/battery, evaluating different props on your power system of choice is probably the cheapest way to experiment at the field which is where it matters most to the majority of us I would suspect :)

    Even if you don't have a thrust stand, don't be scared to experiment at the field. To really have an idea what is going on with your power setup in the environment (ie climate, altitude, etc) in which you live and fly, an inexpensive wattmeter will give you direct feedback on what is happening with your power setup and could save you money in the long run by preventing motor/ESC/battery burnout. This one from Banggood is a pretty good deal https://www.banggood.com/G_T_Power-...005954.html?rmmds=mywishlist&cur_warehouse=CN

    Anyway, just my thoughts for what they are worth based on far too many hours of misspent youth bench testing and at the flying field;)

    A big thanks to all those who have been adding to this thread, sharing their bench and field test experiences, it has been great to share my experiences and learn from all of you who have contributed :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  9. Flybyknight22

    Flybyknight22 Top Gun

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    WWWWHAT!

    Oh, oh no you didn’t, did you?

    FaFaFaFOUR CELLS? You running on Four Cells?

    I can’t believe this!

    What is this world coming too!

    Oh the HORROR,.. NOT FOUR CELLS!

    Absolutely,... BRILLIANT Scott! :p

    It reminds me of a “Scat Pack” with a “Shaker” hood scoop!

    9831724B-1610-437E-8FB1-52D64E47C3E8.jpeg
     
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  10. Flybyknight22

    Flybyknight22 Top Gun

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    Scott,

    Your thread here on park jet motors is perhaps one of the best if not the very best repository of info and testing on the web.

    This is my go to thread for motors and props for the size planes we fly.

    This thread is an excellent resource, if the info ain’t here, you propably don’t need it :p

    New and old alike should gain valuable info from all the testing you have accomplished here. I still go back and look through some of the older material from time to time.

    Five years old but still just as relevant and is the “sweet spot” for motor testing and info for me.

    Well done Scotty!
     
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  11. I will second that, my go to thread. :)
     
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  12. Flybyknight22

    Flybyknight22 Top Gun

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    Ha!

    With all this new 4S testing Scott is doing he may need to trade in his thrust stand for a,...

    DYNO!
     
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  13. Flybyknight22

    Flybyknight22 Top Gun

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    This new toy I have has a built in Dyno and I have been doing some “street testing”. :p

    A4EA0481-97D8-494F-8B55-5A8AB3EE5E1C.jpeg

    It runs on “MoJo Oil”.
    I may need to send you and Scott a couple cans to sprinkle on those motor bearings you’re running on 4S
    :p
    DF059656-7427-4BAD-858D-1C7BC5E1CDD0.jpeg
     
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  14. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    @Wildthing and @Flybyknight22, thanks for the kind words, glad this thread has been helpful to you:)

    In the last couple days, I have received a bunch of goodies in the mail from Banggood, so more testing to be done over the coming days/weeks between flying and other spring/summer activities:)
    2018-05-18 13.27.47.jpg
    I received the last two quad racing motors that I wanted to test, the BrotherHobby EngineerX 2307 2700 kv https://www.banggood.com/Brotherhob...-for-RC-Drone-p-1266599.html?rmmds=mywishlist and the EMAX LS2206 2700 kv https://www.banggood.com/EMAX-LS220...ushless-Motor-p-1204499.html?rmmds=mywishlist. It is kind of cool as I have been corresponding with EngineerX about this motor and the input he had with BrotherHobby in it's design. It is one of the "chunkiest" quad motors I will test at 2307 size, but looks like it might have some real potential on 3 and 4S. Here is EngineerX's test video of it as well.
    2018-05-18 13.28.13.jpg

    The EMAX LS2206 2700 is at the other end of the spectrum being a bit lighter but having potential for some good power.
    2018-05-18 13.28.36.jpg
    Here is another of EngineerX's test videos of this motor.


    I also received some 5" props from Banggood to test on a few different motors on 4S
    DALPROP 5045BN props https://www.banggood.com/2-Pairs-DA...p-1056217.html?rmmds=myorder&cur_warehouse=CN

    Gemfan 5045 BN props https://www.banggood.com/4PCS-Bulln...80-310-Frame-Kits-p-985839.html?rmmds=myorder

    and

    KingKong 5040 props https://www.banggood.com/10-Pairs-K...html?rmmds=myorder&stayold=1&cur_warehouse=CN

    Hopefully I will be able to find the right prop/motor/ESC combo to push this baby past the 100 mph mark on 4S :)


    More to follow in the future, I'm also waiting on some 5" props from HobbyKing and some KingKong 6040 props https://www.banggood.com/10-Pairs-K...-p-988179.html?rmmds=myorder&cur_warehouse=CN from Banggood that EngineerX seems to be getting some good numbers with on 3S on many of the quad motors he has tested.

    Thanks again for the kind words and support, gents:)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  15. Flybyknight22

    Flybyknight22 Top Gun

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    My Son and I use a lot of these 3-Blade 5 inch DAL props on our racing quads with 2300KV Race Star motors. We have had good results from them and use them almost exclusively.

    They also come in various different tips on the end other than the bull nose. Some we have been using are called cyclone tipped. They have a sharper more pointed profile near the end of the prop.

    Four 2300KV motors on 4S, throwing four of these 3-bladed 5 inch DAL props at high RPMs puts out tremendous power on a 250-class quad. All four running up make a rather wicked chop sound.

    At full throttle, straight vertical hole shot with these props and motors, the quad is out of sight in about 4 seconds.

    We like ‘em, good props for quad racers for sure.

    Interested to see what you come up with in your testing of these Scott.
     
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  16. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I manage to get a good 4S test session done earlier today to test the 5" props linked in post #894 above. You can go right to the motor test spreadsheet if you want to see the numbers https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KLR_wdkJ1OdGcf5f9jxxxU8qqmz_kXjMQH8NOLjW3NQ/edit?usp=sharing

    Rather than fill this post up with a whole bunch of links, you can find links to all the motors/props/ESCs and batteries on the spreadsheet by navigating around, each motor has it's own tab along the bottom to help find what you are looking for.

    I tested three motors today, the EMAX RS2306 2750 motor, the GepRC GR2306 2750 motor (so far the most powerful quad motor I have tested and flown on 3S) and the Racerstar BR2406 2600 motor which I think is the leading candidate for inexpensive efficient power of all the quad motors I have tested.

    Unfortunately, the results with the 5" props was disappointing, I never came anywhere near close to the 1630 gr/57.5 oz of thrust I am currently getting out of the EMAX 2306 2750 kv motor and 6x3 EMP prop on 4S with any of the 5" props on any of the motors tested on 4S, so I don't think any of them is going to help me in my quest to get my modified Su-30 V4 over 100 mph. However, there is a nice surprise coming up later ;)

    First a bit on the props, here is a picture of the three of them together.
    2018-05-19 08.06.24.jpg
    The grey King Kong 5040 prop is the most flexible of the bunch, however perfectly balanced out of the package. The Gemfan and Dalprop 5045s were about the same stiffness and both required a small amount of balancing. As you can see in the picture, the Gemfan prop is just slightly longer than the other two. The overall winner of the 5" props just based on thrust numbers seen (of course it comes with a pretty good amp penalty) was the Dalprop 5045 BN, but the 1470 gr/51.9 oz of thrust on the GepRC motor (which was the best result of all the 5" props) still falls well short of what I already have with the EMAX 2306 2750 and 6x3 EMP prop.

    I tested the Racerstar BR2406 2600 motor with all the 5" props on 4S and it produced some pretty good power and did so very efficiently. I think it would leave the widest window of experimentation on 4S with varying pitches of 5" props compared to the other motors. I also tested it on 4S with the 6x3 EMP prop and saw some very good numbers for a 2600 kv motor. Test was done using the Turnigy AE-45A ESC (keeping on the budget theme as it is about half the price of the HobbyWing ESC I used with the EMAX and GepRC motors) with custom settings of 22.5 degrees timing and 24 KHz PWM frequency.

    50% throttle - 16.8A/275W producing 797 gr/28.1 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 43.8A/678W producing 1460 gr/51.5 oz of thrust.

    I haven't been able to find a definitive amp limit number for this motor, from data tables I have seen 41.5A, but I think it will be worth field testing again as an experiment searching for inexpensive quad motor power for a park jet. I have been very impressed with it's performance on 3S, so that will be an interesting test on 4S with the 6x3 EMP prop:)

    So, for the star of the show in today's testing, as I was testing the GepRC with the 5" props on 4S, I decided to test it with the 6x3 EMP prop as well as I had not done that previously. I used the HobbyWing Platinum PRO 40A ESC with custom settings of 26.25 degrees timing and 8 KHz PWM frequency like I have been using with the EMAX motor in my 4S flights.

    50% throttle - 26.9A/429.1W producing 1040 gr/36.7 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 60.3A/896W producing 1770 gr/62.4 oz of thrust.

    Wow! This is the first time I have ever seen any motor I have ever tested produce more than 1000 gr of thrust just at half throttle.

    I am a bit concerned about the amp number at full throttle as it is right at the very limit of the burst buffer of the ESC and about 15A more than what I think the motor is rated for :/ Although I don't normally like to do it, I will trust the theory that the numbers in the air are about 30% lower than on the bench and just see what happens. The plane goes so fast that my full throttle bursts are only about 5 sec maximum or I run out of real estate too quickly:). The motor was warm after a five second burst at full throttle on the bench, but of course no cooling airflow like I should have in the air. So will about an 8% increase in thrust on the bench translate to at least 4% increase in speed in the air to push me over 100 mph? Only one way to find out, time to put the GepRC in the Su-30 V4, say a little extra prayer to the RC gods and see what happens:)

    It does make sense why the GepRC although the same size is so much more powerful than the EMAX motor, based on the actual KV measurement from EngineerX's video below (KV measurement taken at about 10:40 in the video) is 2820 kv whereas I have read from two different sources that the actual kv rating of the EMAX 2306 2750 motor is 2630 kv.


    Cheers,

    Scott
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018
  17. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I managed to get some initial bench testing done on the BrotherHobby EngineerX 2307 2700 kv motor yesterday:)https://www.banggood.com/Brotherhob...html?rmmds=myorder&stayold=1&cur_warehouse=CN I just noticed the regular price is now $30.67 USD, when I purchased it, the regular price was $23.99 which is the current price on sale, not sure what is going on there, I certainly don't think it is worth $30.67 from what the bench numbers tell me anyway.
    2018-05-18 13.28.13.jpg
    You can go straight to the motor test spreadsheet for the numbers here https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KLR_wdkJ1OdGcf5f9jxxxU8qqmz_kXjMQH8NOLjW3NQ/edit?usp=sharing

    I tested it only on 3S for now, starting with the 6x4 APC gas prop (link to all the components used in testing can be found on the spreadsheet above) and the numbers were nothing too exciting, but the amp draw was quite low compared to other quad racing motors I have tested in the same size and kv range. I had remembered a brief conversation I had with EngineerX on his YouTube channel that this motor was not perhaps for blinding speed, but should have very good torque, so I tested the 6x4 KMP/TGS/EMP prop which normally needs a little more torque to spin well. The top end thrust numbers were a little better, amps were still reasonable, so I decided to try the Gemfan 6045 carbon nylon prop and that really provided some good thrust, but with about the same amp draw as the 6x4 KMP.

    This is one of the biggest quad motors I have tested thus far from a standpoint of stator size at 2307, but it is still pretty light, with the prop, connectors, etc ready to go in the plane, it weighs 48 gr/1.7 oz which is comparable to many of the 2306/2305 size motors.
    2018-05-19 13.43.38.jpg
    Here are the numbers using the GF 6045 CN prop, the Turnigy AE-45A ESC with custom settings of 22.5 degrees timing and 24 KHz PWM frequency on 3S for this motor.

    50% throttle - 15.7A/192.3W producing 635 gr/22.4 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 39.4A/451.3W producing 1200 gr/42.3 oz of thrust.

    Based on the amp draw to produce this kind of thrust, it is relatively efficient and from my experience testing the GF 6045 CN prop on other motors, these thrust numbers should translate well over to the field.

    I hope to get some field testing with it within the next week:)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  18. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I just finished up some initial testing on the EMAX LS2206 2700 Kv motor https://www.banggood.com/EMAX-LS220...p-1204499.html?rmmds=myorder&cur_warehouse=CN, sells for $17.99 USD at Banggood. Again, I just tested on 3S for now.
    2018-05-16 14.24.54.jpg
    You can again go straight to the spreadsheet here for all the numbers and links to the components used in the testing
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KLR_wdkJ1OdGcf5f9jxxxU8qqmz_kXjMQH8NOLjW3NQ/edit?usp=sharing

    I started off with the 6x4 APC gas prop, numbers were pretty good, a bit better than the BrotherHobby EngineerX motor above, but the amp draw was higher. I decided to go straight to the Gemfan 6045 carbon nylon prop and the amps drawn didn't jump too much, but the thrust produced jumped considerably from about 1040 gr to 1270 gr:)

    This is very good considering it is a smaller, lighter motor, weighing just 44 gr/1.6 oz ready to go in the plane.
    2018-05-20 07.28.13.jpg
    As you might know from following this thread, I have been a big fan of the EMAX RS2306 2750 kv motor which has been an outstanding performer on the bench and at the field, so I am excited to see what this lighter motor can do, according to EngineerX's test video, it tested as a 2700 kv motor, which is a little higher than the 2630 kv that his gear measured for the 2306 2750.:)

    Here are the numbers on 3S using the Gemfan 6045 carbon nylon prop and the Turnigy AE-45A ESC with custom settings of 22.5 degrees timing and 24 KHz PWM frequency.

    50% throttle - 15.7A/190.1W producing 630 gr/22.2 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 41.9A/480.7W producing 1270 gr/44.8 oz of thrust.

    I have not been able to find what the max amp rating is of this motor yet, but considering the 2306 2750 has held up to some real punishment without too much heat build up or issues, I would suspect this LS2206 2700 should be able to handle the amps. Once I have a chance to fly it which I hope will be within the next week, I will know better, but it looks promising:)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  19. XDmToter

    XDmToter Ace Pilot

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    Hello Again, Scott.

    Do you have any flight video of the GepRC GR2306 2750 kv motor running on 4S? I see you have it listed in your spreadsheet with results from a bench test on 4S, but I didn't see any video of a 4S flight.

    Planning on building another one of these in the near future:
    [​IMG]

    The first SR-71 I built was running the NTM Propdrive 28-36 3000KV Motor, which weighs 87 Grams.
    The numbers on the GepRC show more thrust from a motor that is over 60% lighter. Should be a beast.
     
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  20. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    I should have some video of the GepRC on 4S shot in the next day or two hopefully, it is a little beast, the most powerful of all the quad racing motors I have tested thus far:)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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