PARKJET MOTOR BENCH TESTING

Discussion in 'Electronics' started by e3_Scott, Jul 6, 2013.

  1. OldSchoolFlyer

    OldSchoolFlyer Airman

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    Photo of engine install this is a RCP F-15 mod to resemble a F-4 Phantom IMG_20180416_103709.jpg
     

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  2. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Glad you had a good experience. Can't really answer how your motor will do with the 5x3 prop on 4S. Some important things to know are what the amp limit is on your motor either from published specifications or testing perhaps that other folks have done as pushing the motor beyond that amp limit will cause the motor to overheat more quickly and potentially fail.

    I'm not sure if you have a wattmeter or are planning to get one, they are a vital tool if you want to experiment with motors/props/ESCs/batteries. The prop/motor combo drive everything else as they determine how many amps are required and the motor has no "fail safe" or circuit breaker, it will pull whatever amps it needs to in trying to spin the prop to the RPM based on kv multiplied by voltage. Once you know how many amps the prop/motor combo pull and ensure you are staying under the rated amp limit of the motor, you can determine what ESC and battery you need. Personally, I always go with an ESC that has a base rating that can handle the amps the motor/prop combo require, I don't purposely rely on the burst rating as they are often not accurate or the manufacturer is a bit optimistic. Then you can determine what battery will handle the amps by multiplying the amps of the battery by the C rating, so in your case 2.2 x 25 = 55. In this case you actually had an ESC that could have allowed more amps to be drawn than your battery might be able to safely deliver unless you already knew the amp draw of your motor, I'm not sure.

    Either way, I would recommend spending $12 for a wattmeter like this one from Banggood https://www.banggood.com/G_T_Power-...005954.html?rmmds=mywishlist&cur_warehouse=CN as it takes a lot of the guesswork out of it and can go a long way to help prevent you from cooking a motor/ESC/battery.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
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  3. OldSchoolFlyer

    OldSchoolFlyer Airman

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    Thanks Scott Sharing all your results and a little "how to' IS VERY MUCH APPRECIATED
     
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  4. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Sure thing. Another thing that might be helpful to you and to others is to post the link to the component or components that you are using, often having another set or several sets of eyes looking at specs might allow folks to give you better feedback, especially if they have experience with a particular brand of prop/motor/ESC/battery.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  5. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I managed to get out and validate some of the bench test data I discussed in post #856 above. :)


    The SunnySky Edge R2305 2800 kv motor matched with the 6x3 EMP/TGS/KMP (depending on where you buy them from) using the Turnigy AE-45A ESC with custom settings of 22.5 degrees timing and 24 KHz PWM frequency is thus far probably the fastest quad racing combo I have tested. Previously, the EMAX 2306 2750 kv motor (which I still have to field test with this prop) paired with the 6x4 APC gas prop was the fastest, but today I saw better speed, acceleration and torque with this combo. Where I really noticed it's speed was not necessarily in the high speed passes but when I put it into a full throttle 360 degree turn I could see that it was faster than any of the other combos I have tested.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  6. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I received another motor in the mail yesterday, the GepRC GR2306 2750 kv https://www.banggood.com/Geprc-GR23...p-1240972.html?rmmds=myorder&cur_warehouse=CN
    2018-04-17 13.44.07.jpg
    I picked this motor up after watching this review and bench test video from EngineerX's YouTube channel. He does an excellent job of reviewing motors and even pulls them apart and lets you see the "guts" before he tests them. I exchanged a few notes with him and he told me he felt this motor would be a real beast in a park jet. Based on the numbers I will post below, I completely agree :)


    You can read more details of my initial impressions of this motor on this blog post http://scottsparkjetblog.blogspot.ca/2018/04/initial-impressions-and-bench-testing_18.html

    You can also go straight to the motor test spreadsheet here, I tested this motor with the 6x4 APC gas and 6x3 EMP props with three different ESCs on 3S https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KLR_wdkJ1OdGcf5f9jxxxU8qqmz_kXjMQH8NOLjW3NQ/edit?usp=sharing

    You can scroll along the bottom of the spreadsheet to find the page for this and all the other motors I have tested thus far.

    Based on the bench numbers alone, I think this motor might be pushing the EMAX RS2306 2750 kv motor out of top spot for all the quad racing motors I have tested thus far. More mid and top end power, perhaps not as efficient, but the bench testing gives me the impression it will be a real beast :)

    This motor again preferred the Turnigy AE-45A ESC with custom settings of 22.5 degrees for the timing and 24 KHz PWM frequency like so many other motors seem to prefer also.

    Here are the numbers for the best results with the 6x4 APC gas prop.

    50% throttle - 19.9A/238W producing 685 gr/24.2 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 45A/506.3W producing 1115 gr/39.3 oz of thrust.

    Numbers for the 6x3 EMP prop.

    50% throttle - 18.9A/225.8W producing 730 gr/25.7 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 41.7A/478.2W producing 1290 gr/45.5 oz of thrust.

    Wow :) I would probably feel comfortable flying this motor with the 6x4 APC gas prop, it is rated as a 45A motor and from experience I know the Turnigy AE-45A can be pushed to it's limit also although it does get a bit warm. But after seeing those numbers with the 6x3 EMP prop...:) Other than testing on 4S, I have never had a motor/prop combo produce more than 700 gr thrust at mid throttle and almost 1300 gr at full throttle...almost scary, but in a good way ;). Anyway, I won't be fooling around, when I flight test it, I will be using the Turnigy AE-45A ESC and the 6x3 EMP prop on this little beast :) Hope to get it out for a spin very soon :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  7. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I managed to get out and put a dozen flights through the GepRC GR2306 2750 kv motor setup as described in post #866 above :) This is the fastest quad racing motor setup I have tested on the bench and at the field thus far and on 3S, one of the most powerful motors I have ever tested period :)

    You can read more details on my post flight impressions at this blog post http://scottsparkjetblog.blogspot.ca/2018/04/initial-post-flight-report-geprc-gr2306.html

    Flight video


    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  8. Very cool Scott. I just looked at the link to Bangood, it is a pricey motor at $28.35 CA.
     
  9. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    True enough. Considering the prop and ESC are not terribly expensive, to have this much power and performance on 3S, I suppose each individual has to determine what they want to spend. Certainly there are less expensive combinations available, but nothing as powerful as this setup.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  10. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    Managed another field test today trying the 6x3 EMP prop on the EMAX RS2306 2750 kv motor https://hobbyking.com/en_us/emax-rs2306a-2750kv-black-version-motor.html. Before the GepRC motor showed up, this was the most powerful quad racing motor I had tested to this point. It is still very powerful, even more so with the 6x3 EMP prop.

    As mentioned in the video, while not quite as powerful as a couple other motors I have recently tested, this motor is quite a bit more efficient while producing a lot of power, drawing about 5A less at full throttle than the SunnySky Edge and GepRC motors. Also, given that it has the highest amp rating of 58A, and is one of the best quality motors I have tested for the price, I think it would make a great candidate for experimenting with 4S with this same prop :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  11. XDmToter

    XDmToter Ace Pilot

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    Hello Again Scott. Do you, or anyone else here on the forum, have any experience with the HQProp 6 x 4.5 Carbon Composite props? I am wondering how this compares to the Gemfan 6 x 4.5 Carbon Nylon that you recommend for the 2212/2826 2200KV motor.
     
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  12. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi XDmToter -

    I have not tried the prop you link, but it looks very much like the Gemfan 6045 CN prop. Here are some pictures comparing the GF prop to the 6x4 APC gas prop. I would say the prop AMain is selling looks very similar from what I can see, it is one of the stiffest props I have ever tried thus far. Other than the fact the shipping might be expensive, might be worth a try for $1.99 for two props :)
    2018-03-23 12.13.44.jpg

    2018-03-23 13.24.27.jpg

    The blade on the Gemfan has a much more subtle curve to it, I think the pitch keeps going all the way to the tip whereas the APC style prop tends to flatten out a bit more in the last 1/2" or so. Given the extra pitch, slightly larger blade area and the fact the prop is a bit longer, it all seems to add up to a great prop for 2200-2600 kv motors I have experimented with thus far.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  13. XDmToter

    XDmToter Ace Pilot

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    I don't know what they quoted you for shipping up there in Canada, but to a US address, shipping was $1.99. So for a total of $1.99 per Prop, they are still cheaper than the APC electric props I can get from the local hobby shop.
    I'll let you know how it goes. Although I will only be able to compare them to the TGS 6x4 and the APC Electric 6x4. I didn't order any of the Gemfan 6x4.5 yet.
     
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  14. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    I have ordered 6x4 APC gas props from AMain on a couple of occasions, I have been very impressed with the shipping cost to Canada, probably the best I have ever had from a US vendor, plus it was here within the time window they guaranteed and was very well packaged. I would certainly buy from AMain again :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
  15. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    So every once in awhile I see a motor that is labelled for a crazy high kv rating and I guess I get a bit "starry eyed" thinking it will be the next best motor to come along, sometimes it works out, sometimes not, but the jury is still out on this particular motor :)

    I just received this EaglePower SA2306 2888 kv motor in the mail, again "going broke saving money";) as it was on sale for $16.49 (regular price $20.99).https://www.banggood.com/EaglePower...258081.html?rmmds=mywishlist&cur_warehouse=CN
    2018-04-16 12.22.30.jpg
    I wrote this blog post already mentioning how it was a bit disappointing when I started testing it with the 6x4 APC gas prop as well as some other thoughts about the motor http://scottsparkjetblog.blogspot.ca/2018/04/initial-impressions-and-testing-of.html

    However, compared to the DYS Samguk Shu 2306 2800 kv motor which ended up being a complete dud, I think that I might be able to salvage some decent performance out of this motor on 3S by "propping up" to the Gemfan 6045 carbon nylon prop. I put the details of testing with this prop in the motor test spreadsheet https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1KLR_wdkJ1OdGcf5f9jxxxU8qqmz_kXjMQH8NOLjW3NQ/edit?usp=sharing

    So here are the best numbers with the 6x4 APC gas prop for comparison sake using the Turnigy AE-45A ESC on 3S.

    50% throttle - 12.5A/152.1W producing 515 gr/18.2 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 33.8A/415.4W producing 960 gr/33.9 oz of thrust.

    When I saw that the amp draw was fairly low and reading that this is a 45A motor, I decided to put the GF 6045 CN prop on it and run the test again with the Turnigy AE-45A ESC on 3S.

    50% throttle - 13.4A/163.6W producing 585 gr/20.6 oz of thrust;

    100% throttle - 32.6A/377.3W producing 1110 gr/39.2 oz of thrust.

    So big improvement and still pretty efficient. I watched EngineerX's video review of this motor and started to get a better idea why perhaps it doesn't perform as well as I might have thought. If you watch the video starting at about 10:08, his equipment actually measures an actual kv of 3230!

    I thought the tolerance between the magnets and stator was pretty tight, but perhaps the motor I received is a bit different. I can see his point that the magnets are quite thin compared to some other motors and the gap between each magnet as it is arranged on the bell is a bit larger than say perhaps on the GepRC 2306 2750 kv motor.
    2018-04-16 12.23.35.jpg
    He actually tested the motor on 5S even though it is rated for 3-4S, so perhaps this might be a motor that would perform better on 4S.

    The test numbers with the GF 6045 CN prop put this motor somewhere between the Racerstar BR2406 2600 kv and Multistar Viking 2208 2600 kv motors, so I'll give it a whirl at the field very soon as see how it works out :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  16. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Everyone -

    I managed to get out to the field today and flight test the EaglePower SA2306 2888 kv motor with the Gemfan 6045 carbon nylon prop on 3S, more details about this motor in the post above (#875)



    I was pleasantly surprised with how well this motor and prop combo worked out. As the motor got a chance to really wind out, it seemed to perform beyond what the numbers said from the bench testing which is always a good thing :)

    Ran smooth and strong the whole time, great torque, decent acceleration and good efficient speed and power :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  17. Combatevolved

    Combatevolved Ace Pilot

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    Looks fast Scott.
    The emax 2206 LS (light spec) 2700kv produces over 2000g of static thrust weighing 29g. Waiting for my one to turn up from banggood so will get some 3s and 4s ST and Amp numbers rolling soon. I'm hoping it will perform like our 2306 motors but lighter.
     
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  18. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Thanks, there are certainly even faster setups on 3S, the GepRC is thus far the most powerful quad racing motor I have tested in a park jet.

    What prop/ESC/battery combo was being used when the EMAX 2206 2700 motor produced 2 Kg of thrust, do you know? I looked at the Banggood site and didn't see anything, but perhaps I wasn't looking hard enough.

    If you are looking for lightweight power, the Foxeer DATURA X2206 2700 is one of the lightest I have bench and field tested, 42 gr once the prop and other hardware are installed. https://www.banggood.com/Foxeer-Dat...-p-1196244.html?rmmds=search&cur_warehouse=CN, it weighs 31 gr before putting anything on it https://scottsparkjetblog.blogspot.ca/2018/01/foxeer-datura-x2206-2700-kv-quad-racing.html. On 3S with the 6x3 TGS prop, it produces 615 gr at 50% throttle drawing 14.8A and at full throttle produces 1145 gr drawing 35.2A. It also feels like it has quite a bit more torque than it's size would normally indicate, certainly more than the BrotherHobby Returner R2 2205 2800 from my field testing.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  19. Combatevolved

    Combatevolved Ace Pilot

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    The test was performed by engineer X the chap you linked above who tested the Gepmotor you use.

    The 2 props used were the HQ6045 2019g and the King Kong 6040 2045g. Engineer x used to use a 40a plush esc. I would run this motor using either 2s, 3s or 4s Graphenes spinning 6x4 or 6x3 props (Tgs). Even the smallest graphenes can discharge 58.5a continuously. For 2s and 3s the 30a turnergy is more than enough with a 6x4 prop but for 4s I'd either down prop to 6x3 or use a 40a esc (Try to avoid this due to the weight penalty).

    Screenshot_20180425-075451.png

    The you tube link is;



    There is also a great discussion on RC Groups about this motor.

    www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?2968343-EMAX-OFFICIAL-LS2206-LS2207-Lite-Spec-Series-Brushless-Motors




    The R2 returner seems to be a very efficient motor when using a light prop such as the tgs 6x3 and a light plane. Infact It helps my planes to stays in the air the longest of all the motors I have tested. Probably because the planes I build are very light and the amp draw is moderate on 2 and 3s.

    Not comparative but using a 6x4tgs prop and turnergy plush 30a esc with my 2212 2700kv cheap motor which is heavy at 50g, produces 660g ST @20a 8.5v and 1260g [email protected] 40a on 12.75v. This is a £3.88 motor the value and performance is outstanding for the cost.

    The Foxeer Datura looks to be a very efficient motor I'd be interested in picking one up and using it for sure. Great information as always Scott. Screenshot_20180425-083918.png Screenshot_20180425-083911.png
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2018
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  20. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Thanks. Best of luck with your testing.

    I've ordered an EMAX LS2206 2700 motor to try out.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2018
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