Parkflyers International F/A-18 Super Hornet G1R: A New Experience, A New Frontier

Discussion in 'Scratchbuilding!' started by bimoadiprakoso, Oct 17, 2017.

  1. I don't remember what motor but soft or hard throttle it did the same thing, dirt nap. Then you watch Bimo's launch and smooth as silk.
     
  2. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Ok, thanks, but what was the issue, torque roll, insufficient pitch?

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
  3. Splashballz

    Splashballz Ace Pilot

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    Hi Scott,

    It’s brilliant that you’re giving this one a crack!! It’s easily the best thing in my hangar, though more like a wild brumby than a loyal dog - I could never tell what was going to happen on launch.

    I originally built stock-size with 6x12gm servos on board and it was a brick, for my power set-up (DYS 2600kv / 6x4 / 3 or 4s).
    Dropped it back to 4 servos, shortened some wiring and the weight was much better.

    Left-roll on launch was an issue for me, but I also discovered that when I looked at the elevon anchor points from the back (the fixed areas forward of the elevon hinge line), my right elevon had a very minor downward deflection, which I suspect would have contributed to the left roll - so it may not have been a torque roll issue so much as a build issue.

    I also reinforced the anchor points with popsicle sticks, as there was a lot of pitch demand on this area. See below.

    I’ll have a think back over the rest of the build and let you know if anything else that might help, cheers.


    [​IMG]




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  4. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Thanks much, Ben, I will definitely keep a close eye on all my control surface deflections for the maiden flight and appreciate the tip on the reinforcement on the horizontal stabilizer.

    I will be doing my best to keep things light, 9 gr servos for the elevons, 5 gr servos for the ailerons and hopefully one single 5 gr servo for the rudders. I don't plan to make the rudders too big and since they won't be getting bashed around by prop wash, I am hoping the 5 gr servo can move the rudders sufficiently when I might need them in the wind or when flying slow/high alpha. The motor I will be using should be about the same weight as what you are using, I have another quad racing motor on order from Banggood that I picked up specifically to test with a 3 blade prop on 3S which I will have tested in another plane before I try it out on the F18 if it works out OK. It will be this one in 2522 kv https://www.banggood.com/Racerstar-...l?rmmds=mywishlist&ID=553933&cur_warehouse=CN

    Probably end up using a 40A ESC and setting it up with the FlySky FS-i6 transmitter as I have been really enjoying that for it's price, simplicity and capabilities over the last few months.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
  5. Splashballz

    Splashballz Ace Pilot

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    Sounds like a plan. Just to clarify, mine wasn’t so much a correctable elevon deflection issue, but a structural malalignment. Have a look in the photo below; you can see the relativity of each anchor point to the wing on the same side. I made attempts to correct it but would need to disassemble too much of the frame.

    [​IMG]


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  6. Heck you never know, maybe I did the same thing. Once I decided to build the 120% plane the other one was in the trash already.
     
  7. Hey Scott, remember 0 prop wash so high alpha and rudder don't work together, have to maintain some airspeed for anything to work.
     
  8. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Did you actually test rudders on your F18?

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
  9. If the plane isn't moving it's not going to do anything.
     
  10. Splashballz

    Splashballz Ace Pilot

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    I had rudders on the original version, with flexible pushrods routed from servos toward the front. First time I had attempted this, and it worked really well, at least when I got it airborne for a few maiden laps. I didn’t attempt anything fancy with them though, so go with Jeff’s insights there.

    I had to remove them due to the AUW issue. I don’t have a great picture but you might be able to get an idea from these...


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]





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  11. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    In my experience, a plane doing high alpha is still moving forward, otherwise it is hovering or falling out of the sky. There will still be some airflow going over the rudders and the elevons albeit very little, however that does not mean they will be completely ineffective. I understand there will not be prop wash moving over the elevons or the rudder, however the RCP F18 V2 had no elevon surface in the prop wash and still managed to maintain a very respectable high angle of attack in high alpha. High alpha with this plane might be more challenging than with others and perhaps might not be a "scale" angle of attack of around 40 degrees but I would not say it is impossible until it has been attempted.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2018
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  12. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Thanks Ben, I will probably try to put the elevon and aileron servos close to the CG area and have the single rudder servo in the middle of the top of the fuselage probably slightly ahead of the leading edge of the vertical stabilizers, depending on where my receiver ends up underneath so that I can perhaps avoid a servo extension between the rudder servo and the receiver. I noted in some of your previous pictures you mounted your ESC internally, is that a good assumption? If so, did you have it up close to the "secret" hatch on the bottom of the plane? It would be my intention to do this as my field is often wet about 6 months of the year when I fly, so I want to try and avoid any moisture getting to my ESC.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  13. Splashballz

    Splashballz Ace Pilot

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    So the early version of this plane had no secret hatch - that was an idea that Jim or Bimo came up with later. I opted for a top hatch, for two reasons:

    1) all my planes have top hatches, so it was familiar,

    2) I’ve always tried to keep the esc-lipo leads as short as possible, which for a rear-mount meant longer esc-motor leads. Think I read somewhere that long esc-lipo leads could cause an issue, so I’ve stuck with it. But the esc-motor leads are heavier.

    So my top hatch contained the esc and rx, but this meant I needed longer esc-motor leads which added weight. In needing to reduce the weight, I had to shorten these leads and opt for the secret bottom hatch. But that meant longer esc-lipo leads, which I had typically avoided. I’m not really sure of the implications of this.

    Now I have two hatches, but the esc and rx are both tucked nicely into the bottom one. I’ve never had an esc overheat on me; not sure if performance would be better outboard, but inboard has so far worked for me.


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  14. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Thanks again, Ben. I have some 20 AWG wire that should work well for extensions between the motor and ESC, this is the method I have always preferred to use and the 20 AWG wire should keep things light. The motor leads on most quad motors is 18 or 20 AWG and in my testing of many of those motors over the past year+, it can handle plenty of amps without any problem.

    Once I start cutting foam and seeing how things go together which is not going to happen right away, I will figure out what I need to do in the way of hatches. I hope to be able to put everything other than the battery down below if I need to change any connections, etc most of the stuff will be in one place and then keep the battery up top under the canopy area.

    Although I mentioned I will build mostly with MPF, I might have some bigger scraps of Depron around for the elevons and vertical stabs rudders which shouldn't need any extra reinforcement, so that should also help me keep the weight down. Thanks for your help, it has been most insightful :)

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  15. Splashballz

    Splashballz Ace Pilot

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    No worries at all!
    Spring is on its way back around in the southern hemisphere - I’m hoping to make some set-up changes to this plane, to see if I can smooth the launch. You’re updates on the i6 might be just what I need to mix some right roll into the throttle, which up until now I haven’t managed to do as my mixes are doing other jobs. But if I can create 4 new channels with a firmware upgrade, who knows...
    Good luck with the build!


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  16. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Hi Ben -

    I'm still researching how to take advantage of those extra channels after doing the firmware upgrade on the FlySky FS-i6. First I would need to pick up a 10 ch receiver so that each servo would have it's own channel. I tried seeing if I could set up V tails to help with more pitch authority on this or other planes, but since I'm already using the elevon setup, it won't allow me to do V tails as well, so more research required. I can find lots of videos about what to use the extra channels for if I was setting up a quad, but not so much a fixed wing plane. As mentioned in the thread I started on the FlySky FS-i6, the main reason I did the upgrade was to have a timer which works awesome.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  17. bimoadiprakoso

    bimoadiprakoso Top Gun

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    Hi Scott.

    So sorry for the late jumping in. Do you need bigger size? PI plans have been designed to be flexible in scaling up to 10% without any changes in registers/tabs.

    It can be printed through Adobe Reader easily from an untiled plan to become tiled one, 10% bigger than the original size. Kindly let me know if you need the bigger size so I could do it for you, giving you no hassles

    Parkflyers International Parkjets

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  18. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Thanks for the offer, Bimo, I'm still not 100% sure what direction I am going to go yet.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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  19. bimoadiprakoso

    bimoadiprakoso Top Gun

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    Have no worries Scott When you wanna go with it, just dial the batphone and I will send you the 110% enlarged plan.

    The original size flies very fast with extreme agility. But the larger one gives bigger lift for sure according to Wildthing's flights.

    If you wanna try a new experience in flying the planes pretty much like "fly-by-wire" experience, get the HobbyEagle A3 Super 2 or Super 3 flight stabilization system. It could be the insurance of the plane on some unexpected occassions, but flying the planea with it could also be fun

    I would recommend Super 2 as a start. The Super 3 has some more settings but mostly not substantials for the functions we require. Both can be turned on, off or even having different mode with rudders installed.

    Parkflyers International Parkjets

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  20. e3_Scott

    e3_Scott Top Gun

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    Ok thanks, still more things to consider.

    Cheers,

    Scott
     
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